ROSES.. UK/Europe - Part 2..
Summer 2024..
'Pirouette'..
Comments (313)
Marlorena
yesterdayMarlorena
yesterdayI wish my 'PL' was like Tack's, it's a bit behind.. I think there were ants in the root system earlier.
The foliage on this rose is very similar to 'Silas Marner' although the flower is a different colour. I feel sure they're bred along the same lines, and it's a line I like very much.
All lovely roses earlier.. huge variety going on here.
'Cornelia' in the rain this morning..
'BMS' soon be busting out all over..
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Can you please ID these (I think) HTs ? (Part 2 of 2) (many pics
Comments (5)I wish I had Easy Going, it looks like a beauty, but my yellow has no peach, amber or pink veining or undertones. It's egg-yolk yellow and simply pales to lemon-cream with age. My main regret is that it blows too quickly to a very open, unattractive form. This describes my 'Easy Going'. Actually "the light green shiny foliage" comment makes me lean towards EG, also the growth habit of your standard. Livin Easy, Easy Going, and the offspring Hot Cocoa have very distinctive foliage, prickles, canes, and growth habit. What makes ID trickier in your case that you are in Europe, where there are cultivars we don't have here. Easy Going and Livin Easy are very popular as standards here--whether or not that is true in France, I have no idea. Usually though standard roses, which are much more expensive than the regular ones, are less apt to be an obscure variety because of the extra expense. So look at very common cultivars. Have you looked at Sunsprite and Sunflare? Might also be one of those. Easy Going foliage:...See MoreUS 'found' roses available in Europe?
Comments (27)Indian Love Call has the prettiest wood and hips. I have always loved how the cool temps combined with brilliant winter sun turn the surfaces the sun hits of both a deep purple while the surfaces not receiving direct sun remain deeper green. Those purple and green shades set off the large, brilliant orange hips to perfection. Later in winter, the purple fades to oranges, reds and yellows before the foliage all turns brown and falls, leaving the purple/green wood with sprays of orange hips. I don't have any photos of that, unfortunately, as they're all unscanned 35 mm slides, but this is an Indian Love Call "child". Her strong, smooth canes with their "Basye's Legacy" fall coloring, carry through to further generations, as does her lovely colored foliage. These are pieces of some of her children and grand children. Climbing Yellow Sweetheart can produce amazing basal growth. Thick, strong, tall shoots crowned with enormous flower heads. I had it in a five gallon can waiting for somewhere (which never arrived) to plant it. The thing grew through the drain holes and began pushing these types of shoots. It really reminded me of the type of sumptious flowering shoots the Noisette, Allister Stella Gray used to push for me. Having the excitement and fun of "rediscovering" a "lost" Ralph Moore rose with Jim Delahanty made it even more special. It's actually a cousin of Annie Laurie McDowell's....See MoreNo travel to Europe except UK
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Comments (0)Hello everyone! The discussion about damask roses earlier this year got me wondering if there were any other old garden roses native to the Middle East, especially ancient or historically important ones. I embarked on a quest to find out. Google books and HelpMeFind reference pages provided me with a wealth of information, but there is so much conflicting information, and I am having trouble sorting it all out. I would greatly appreciate it if you could offer me some insight on this subject. I will break down the information and questions by rose classes. Here is what I found out: R. damascena~ From what I understand, the original damask roses that are in commerce in the U.S. are Kazanlik (Trigintipetala), Gloire de Guilan, and Autumn Damask, and possibly York and Lancaster. I have heard that York and Lancaster is a sport of Kazanlik, is this true? Also, some say that Professeur Emile Perrot is a synonym for Kazanlik, while others claim it is a different rose entirely. What is your stance on the subject? I also learned that Kazanlik occasionally repeats bloom in warm climates. I found this surprising, as Autumn Damask is the only mentioned repeat blooming rose in history until the introduction of roses from China. Then again, I read that there used to be two “monthly roses” introduced to Europe prior to the introduction of the China roses, one being a light pink and one being a darker pink. I am wondering if Kazanlik could have been the other “monthly rose.” In regards to the damask rose Ispahan, I have read that it is not a pure damask, and that it is damask mixed with alba or another type of rose. Is this correct? Also, I read that Nancy Lindsay found it growing in Persian gardens in Isfahan, but I couldn’t find out who hybridized it or where it originated from. If it is mixed with alba, then could it have been from Iran? I am unsure of where alba roses are from. Also, what is R. damascena Mill.? I also read that scientists did a genetic analysis of roses grown for oil in Bulgaria versus roses grown for oil in Iran. They found them to be mainly the same type. They also did a study of Kazanlik, York and Lancaster, Autumn Damask, and Perpetual White Moss and found them to all be seedlings of the same cross. R. alba~ Where do alba roses come from? Are they from Europe or the Middle East? All I know is that they are grown in Bulgaria for a lesser quality of rose oil than damask roses, and that one rosarian guesses that they may have come from Crimea. I don’t think anybody knows what they are a cross of, because every website and reference page that I’ve looked at had a different guess for the rose species that were crossed to make the alba roses. R. gallica, R. phoenicia, and R. moschata~ Here is where I got even more confused. Scientists/rosarians have determined that R. gallica is definitely one of the parents the damask rose, as well as nearly every other garden rose in existence. This makes sense, as from what I understand R. gallica is native to the Middle East and southern Europe. (Is this true? Also, does anyone have any other information on R. gallica, I couldn’t find much? All I know is that it was a single-petalled pink rose that was the great, great grandpappy of all our garden roses.) But about half of the rosarians believe that the other parent is R. moschata with a bit of R. fedtschenkoana somewhere in the mix. They say that R. gallica, R. moschata, and R. fedtschenkoana crossed where their ranges meet. But I looked at the map, and discovered that their ranges do not meet. R. moschata’s range is suspected to lie in the western Himalayas and R. fedtschenkoana’s range is in the foothills and mountains of central Asia and northwest China. I got really confused, then happened to stumble on a website that said that there used to be another musk rose, that was native to southern Europe and the Middle East. It was superseded by the hardier species of musk rose from Asia in the late nineteenth century. So it makes sense that damask roses would be a cross of the Middle Eastern musk rose and R. gallica. (Does anyone know anything about the original R. moschata?) But then the other half of rosarians believe that the musk rose is not a parent of the damask rose at all. They believe that the damask rose is a cross between R. gallica and R. phoenicia. This also makes complete sense, as R. phoenicia is native to the Levant. What is your opinion on the subject? Also, do R. phoenicia or R. moschata repeat bloom? I think I read somewhere that R. phoenicia repeats bloom, but I am not sure. That would explain the repeat blooming characteristics of the Autumn Damask rose. R. gallica officinalis (Apothecary’s rose)~ I have a lot of questions about this rose. Is it a species, or is it a cultivar? Also, I read that it was brought to Europe from Syria by the crusader Theobald I of Navarre; I forgot whether it was the same crusader who brought back the damask roses. Is this true? Yet some say that this rose is native to France. Which story is correct? I know that this rose was once called the red damask rose. But people called a lot of different roses damask roses even if they weren’t back in the day. Could this be a reference to where they were found? Were the roses taken from Syria by the crusaders all called damask roses in those times? R. sancta, R. polliana, and R. spinosissima~ R. sancta is a rose I am very interested in. I believe the correct form of this rose is R. sancta richardii, not R. sancta andrews. Is this correct? I read that it was brought from Syria to Ethiopia by Saint Frumentius or other early Christians in 300 AD. How cool is that?! I heard that it is a very close relative of the damask rose, being a cross of R. gallica and R. phoenicia. I’m not sure if it’s from the same cross, or a different cross, or when it came into existence, all I know is that it is very ancient. Does anyone know anything about it? I know it is planted around many ancient churches and monasteries. Yet some say that this rose has gone extinct, and that it was replaced in commerce as R. polliana. Is this true? And where does R. sancta andrews fit in? I think it was gifted to a nurseryman in Italy, but it is not from Italy. Where is it from? It is called St. John’s rose, so I’m thinking it may have some connection to the early Christian church. I could be wrong though. I think on HMF it says that R. sancta andrews is really R. spinosissima. Is this correct? Does anyone know anything about R. spinosissima? R. foetida~ I think the variety of R. foetida in the Middle East is called R. foetida persiana (Persian Yellow). I heard that it is yellow, it stinks (Does it really smell like sulphur?), and that it comes from modern-day Iran. I also heard that it is the first, or one of the first, yellow roses. Is this true? Is it of historical importance? Does anybody know anything about it? Are there other varieties of R. foetida in the Middle East? Thank you to anyone who takes the time to read through this post. I'm sorry for all the questions. Also please feel to correct me if any of my information is incorrect. Any knowledge is greatly appreciated. Have a wonderful day! damask_rose : )...See More
Tack UK
yesterdayI forgot to say that my PL in that (huge) pot is 2 plants! I hope yours does well soon Marlorena. Interesting observation re Silas Marner which I also have. I agree it also has attractive and colourful foliage, but mine is a bit floppy.
Cooldoc
yesterday
oliya_uk
yesterdayMarlorena
yesterdayTack,..
Re Silas,I have a couple of these strategically placed..
.. and for the future..
I'm enchanted by this 'Pastella'..
Marlorena
yesterdaylast modified: yesterday
Rojas
yesterdaylast modified: yesterdayI was excited to receive my first ever potted rose in flower! I had a weak specimen from TCL and I was eyeing for a while and finally managed to get it from Trever White! Hopefully this grows better..
Evelyn:
Cymbeline:
Kathryn Morley:
The Prince:
Chippendale:
Leander:
Olivia Rose Austin:
Constance Spry:
Redoute:
Kate James
yesterday
peter straw
yesterday
Fire zone 8, north London, UK
yesterday
ElbFee
yesterdayFire zone 8, north London, UK
yesterdaypeter straw
yesterday
Peter Aberdeen
yesterdaylast modified: yesterdayStunning rose photos coming in today. I especially like:
- @Nollie in Spain Zone9 's Palais Biron, there is something about that colour! & Ventilo.
- @Marlorena in England 's Sophie's Perpetual (and Freddie!).
- @Tack UK 's Obelisk - magnificent training of Malvern Hills.
- @showa_omori 's Gertrude Jekyll - last year mine went fluorescent too, it was magical.
- @Rojas 's Constance Spry - lovely chalice/cupped shape.
@Marlorena in England - forgive the bad photograph, but here is Tulipa Cairo doing it's 'blaze' in full sun, and yes that is one of my Madam Alfred Carrieres on the back wall:
Marlorena
yesterdayMarlorena
yesterday'Scented Garden'..
'Bienvenue'..
'Pastella'.. rather like a dwarf Eden rose..
'Lilac Bouquet'..
..first bloom on 'Iceberg'.. this spring..
'Lucky' with Aquilegia 'Blue Barlow'..
Nollie in Spain Zone9
yesterdayThanks all, that black granite worktop does come in handy for rose portraits!
Not everything in the rose garden is a triumph…
I thought I had got rid of them, but the ants seem to be back in my Avalanche Abricot pot, unfortunately. It does seem to be affecting general health and the blooms, which are emerging shrunken and distorted. Drastic action required!
Some others in casualty…
Alister Stella Gray and Blush Noisette - both seem to have stalled in growth and both (like the Teas) hated the recent heavy rain - buds refusing to open, a balling, mouldering mess. I’ve deadheaded ASG but this is BN:
Mme. Isaac Pereire, no problem with vigour and it was reaching an impressive first flush - until the rain did this:
Oh and that beastie is my new rose munching nemesis, the White Spotted Rose Beetle.peter straw
yesterdayOne of the pleasant surprises for me this year has been 'Windflower'. Full of vigour and not even a hint of BS. I've had it a number of years now, but I've never seen it so healthy. No blooms as yet but it is full of buds, and it's a bit wispy so needs support.
Eustace_UK_Zone_9a
yesterdaylast modified: yesterdayI thought I will take a few photos in the hot sun - roses drooping in the heat. Only 21 deg C though.
Belle de Jour
Cornelia - first season, purchased after seeing @Marlorena's.
Fully opened Twice in a Blue Moon
First of my herbaceous peonies
Smaller flowers on Susan Williams-Ellis.
Think this is Lili Marlene
An unlabelled HT
Weg der Sinne
Fire zone 8, north London, UK
yesterdaylast modified: yesterdayWonderful re-growth on the big red climbers that are rocketing away. Cutting to the ground feels like such a high-risk strategy but looks like it has paid off. Putting on about two inches a day.
Cooldoc
23 hours ago
Sarah WAMS (England, Zone 8a)
23 hours agoCornelia
GJ
Both new pink standards starting well
Belle de Jour
Lolabelle
Archiduc
Boule de Neige
Tranquillity
Amazing Day
Sarah WAMS (England, Zone 8a)
23 hours agoTack UK
23 hours agolast modified: 23 hours agoYou really do have the most exquisite blooms @Rojas, can't wait for the full Contance Spry wow moment.
Lovely Lilac Bouquet Marlorena, will watch that one with interest.
I am tempted too Eustace by Cornelia, very pretty indeed. Edit and now yours too WAMS, it's going to be too much!
Great to see those lovely red triffids @Fire zone 8, north London, UK, that is quite a growth rate, hope they behave as you wish now
Not at all great there Nollie, hopefully conditions better now and you don't lose too much but I feel for you
Purples tonight, Heidi Klum and first blooms of Purple Lodge/Palais Biron and Eufemia
ElbFee
23 hours agopeter straw
23 hours agoLove it how 'Belle de Jour' changes from deep buttery yellow to a much more gentler yellow, tinged with orange as the blooms age.
Sarah WAMS (England, Zone 8a)
22 hours agoFire zone 8, north London, UK
22 hours agoSarah WAMS (England, Zone 8a)
22 hours agoMarlorena
22 hours agoElbFee
21 hours agoYes, @Wams, as I was strongly encouraged by you, I got rid of Micolas Ales. I moved, I think, James L. Austin in that spot and it is already starting to bloom. Yeah, success and identification coming up. I will be vistiting Europa Rosarium Sangerhausen at the end of the month and will say hello to a sibling of Micolas there.
Oh, you are moving and leaving your garden. Out of curiosity, would you be allowed to import your roses, although probably not the most convenient way to start a new garden.
Todays pics:
Edhelka (North Wales, UK)
19 hours agoSouvenir de St. Anne's
Clg. Mrs. Herbert Stevens
Gertrude Jekyll
Rhododendron 'Percy Wiseman'
I normally treat Welsh poppies as weeds but decided to let them grow this year (which means I'll drown in them in a couple of years and any resemblance of a colour scheme will be ruined but whatever... they are pretty)
Cooldoc
19 hours agoLovely pics all..
May be you can take a cutting? try to root one now or after flowering WAMS..
Quite a good collection of old roses there @ElbFee My fist bloom on Yolande is also having a proliferation problem.. but the resin from bud smells awesome..
It was such a joy today.. got early from work and straight away started sniffing roses..Munstead wood with Nepeta..
Twilight Zone
Julio Iglesias
Louis Odier
Emily Bronte
Scabiosa with Crimson glory in the back ground
new bloom on Gruss an Coburg
Amour de Marie Jo.. another new bareroot this year.. not strong scent yet..
Gertrude J
Fire zone 8, north London, UK
19 hours agooliya_uk
19 hours agoWow! So many gorgeous roses in flower! I’m still waiting for the most of mine to start blooming…
A few more got their first flower today:
Boscobel, For Your Eyes Only, Elina and Souvenir de St Anne’s (smells delicious!)
Rojas
16 hours agolast modified: 16 hours ago@Cooldoc As you can see it on the picture Evelyn came without any support and stem holds the big bloom nicely. It didn't even touched the card board box. Hahaha.. I had similar experience, I have subscribed for the potted roses notification, before I reach it will be sold out. Seems I've managed to nick yours in time ! No basal growth on the other Evelyn so far and I'm giving root drench with Empathy feed. Hopefully thats helps! Love the colours of Julio Iglesias. Twilight Zone is in my wish lis for a long time and that bloom looks really reddish!
@Sarah WAMS (England, Zone 8a). Ahh I envy you a bit as you can get hold of some of the rare old Austins that I'm hunting for! As I've promised earlier, I took Kathryn Morley cuttings for you last autumn and then I came to know about your move! I was sad that I would not be able to get chocolates from you for Kathryn Morley! Just kidding...it was a shocking news. Looks like both cuttings rooted and i'll post the pictures tomorrow. Please try to acquire as many old Austins as possible and share pictures with us!
@Tack UK Constance Spry is nearly there!
Wild Edric - Mostly in Full flush
Cymbeline - Coffee tones
Wellbeing:
Mme Isaac Pereire rose: This rose just doesn't work for me! Got rust badly although I have sprayed multiple times already! The colour looks much faded in person. I should let this go! @Nollie in Spain Zone9 Indeed yours is beautiful and doing much better!
Boscobel:
Crown Princess Margareta:
Eustacia Vye:
Radio Times: Love the scent
Emily Bronte:
I was hunting for a very rare old Austin for a long time and by god's grace I found it. I really wanted one badly but I've ended up with 4! What a blessing :-) I just can't wait to see the blooms. I will post pictures once I know it's a true rose!Eustace_UK_Zone_9a
9 hours agoCooldoc
9 hours agodiscandied
5 hours agoA few more have started to bloom.
Sidonie.
Reine de Violettes.
Sombreuil
Mme Zoetmans
Rosa cristata is not open yet, but looks as impressive in bud.
Marlorena
5 hours agolast modified: 5 hours ago..superb array of roses Rojas.. oh gosh and all the others I've only just seen..
'Lavender Lassie' opened today..
'Comtesse Andre d'Oultremont'..
'Loyal Companion'..
'Sophie's Perpetual'..
'Cornelia'..
Salvia 'Royal Bumble'..
peter straw
5 hours agopeter straw
5 hours agoI've just got to get these for next year. A wonderful clump of Iris's growing in my local park's garden.
The picture doesn't do them justice really. Stunning fresh greens and blue/purples.
showa_omori
4 hours agoSpectacular roses everyone!
Gloire de Dijon
Lady Hillingdon - quite orange today
Rojas
4 hours agoMarlorena
27 minutes ago'Scarborough Fair'..
'Kathleen Harrop'..
''Surpassing Beauty''..
'Dr. O'Donel Brown'.. old HT ..
Eustace_UK_Zone_9a
11 minutes agolast modified: 5 minutes agoSuperb rose pictures. A veritable feast for the eyes and soul. Thanks for sharing. 😊
Today we visited the Waddesdon Manor. The rose garden there is being redone with fairly new planting, including Penelope Lively and Bring Me Sunshine. Very few roses were flowering. Most of the rose plants were only 1 1/2 - 2 ft high. In a few more years, it would be nice to see the pink and yellow rose garden. Here is the layout plan and a few pictures I took.
Tack UK
3 minutes agoThis year it looks like eerything will bloom within the next week whereas nearly half my roses waited until June in 23
Nollie in Spain Zone9